The redefinition of Michael Myers

[Elduardo]

Finally got around to watching the Rob Zombie Halloween remake a few days ago and it brought up some interesting discussion.

Looking at the movie as a standalone, it was quite solid.

Looking it as a Halloween flick though it was a bit problematic. I'm all for the remake in bringing a fresh perspective to a movie but this changed the core definition of Michael Myers in a way that I feel is not reconcilable with the original series as a whole.

The remake introduces concepts of abuse, bullying, animal abuse, etc, that are more indicitive of a Dalhmer like serial killer rather than a slasher like Michael. To me, the concept of a slasher is there is really no deep explanation for the rage, it is what it is.

To remake a classic horror flick is difficult. It's one thing to create a fresh, modern outlook on the story but it is quite another to redefine the character and his motives and origin. Zombie is clearly a talented filmmaker and a Halloween fan but I feel he swung and missed on his journey into the psychological factors that made Michael what he is.

[steelba]

:nono:

[Gatsu18]

I agree with your opinion on Michael's orgin. It felt so much better to me when there was no real reason to his rage. To know that he is just some angsty kid that thinks he's ugly is completely retarded and in no way how I feel anyone perceived his original character. But I can't agree that it was a good stand alone movie. It had some of the worst dialouge that I have ever heard. Sweet little Laurie Strode finger fucked a bagel in front of her mother. I mean what the fuck was that?

[Doc Awesome]

I like only half of the movie. Everything before Michael escapes is complete shit but after he escapes things were quite entertaining to me.

[woodenheart]

I liked it. Rob took the legend or story of Michael Myers and put it in his version of how the character was to be.

[cmurdur]

It would have been pointless for him to go with a "pure evil" concept, because that was already done in the original, so he tried something different.

[3/6]

movie was so/so

"so what, he found a dead cat, boys will be boys right???" :die:

[cmurdur]

movie was so/so

"so what, he found a dead cat, boys will be boys right???" :die:

Oh come on now. Don't tell me you never jacked off to pictures of dead cats. I know I wasn't the only one.

[Elduardo]

A story about a psychopath with an abused background isn't all that different.

Could have done the backstory without changing the concept of the character.

[cmurdur]

Could have done the backstory without changing the concept of the character.

But then that back story would have copied something else. Everything's been done. It's just a matter of how you present it that makes it different.

[3/6]

Oh come on now. Don't tell me you never jacked off to pictures of dead cats. I know I wasn't the only one.

true :D

[Elduardo]

Understood, just seems like when you do a remake it makes the most sense to stick to the fundamental concept of the original.

Could easily make a movie about an abused, bullied, mask wearing killer without it being a Halloween movie.

Most other elements of the film were quite well done in my view.

[Cataclysm]

Yeah, Rob Zombie really has that whole white trash thing down to an art form.

[Wally The Cannibal]

I think it was more of one of those "re-imaginings" than a remake. You know how they like to word things in that there Holloywoodland.

[Misfit]

rob zombie is a fucking tool every film he does is shit

[ReD]

It was an entertaining film IMO.

Still I won't deny Rob needs a lot of work in terms of dialogue.

It would help if he took a walk around public areas. Not everyone talks the way he portray's them in his movies.

Myers back story was changed so be it. Either way, I don't have a problem with either way they choose to perceive the character.

People just didn't like that they changed him from being a mysterious evil doer to a psychopathic evil doer. Its only implied that he simply snapped because of the shit that went down. However Rob never really jumps out and blatantly says 'he had a bad childhood and because of that, he became a maniac'. However it's made to look that way which does become Rob's fault and that goes back to the way he perceives his characters with wack dialogue in all of his films.

People are saying the same thing about Jason except in a different manner. They only want the slow moving, telporting zombie Jason of the more recent times with a big build over what the character was in the early films.

Still all that said, I have no gripes either way.

[txjeff07]

If you have seen RZ's earlier films House of 1000 Corpses and The Devil's Reject's then you wouldn't be surprised at the character portrayal or dialogue in this movie. I for one am a huge fan of the Halloween series and didn't have a problem with RZ trying to give a reason for Myer's rage. It was a different take on the character and if you can handle Zombie's style than I feel you probably enjoyed it.

[ASoron0424]

The theatrical cut was pretty good, but the director's cut was awful.

Overall, not a bad movie, but too ambitious an effort. Especially after only two movies, only one of which was good (TDR).

[Max Power]

-Michael's sister doesn't take him trick or treating.
-Michael cries like a big sissy.
-Michael kills people.
-Michael cries more.
-Michael magically grows 4 feet and gains 200 pounds of muscle and doesn't speak.
-Michael randomly kills more people.
-Michael dies.

I mean this with every breath, with every once of blood and with every bone in my body:

Rob Zombie's Halloween is the worst horror film ever made.

[H78]

RZ's H is shit on celluloid.

[scaryperry]

Yeah, Rob Zombie really has that whole white trash thing down to an art form.

Haha he must be from my neighborhood.

[the liger]

worst horror film ever made is a bit far fetched. i dont think theres anything wrong with making the film with new ideas thats the whole point of a remake and rob zombie made it as a fan with the blessing of john carpenter himself. i think zombie did a great job rehashing it, giving the audience some explanation of why myers is what he is, plus abit more gore for the saw generation so to speak. sure alot of people think classics shouldnt be touched but also theres nothing wrong with giving them a modern look either.

[Jungle_Julia]

When i first watched it i hated it. The problem was me comparing it to the orig. disceting what was changed and what stayed the same which i shouldnt have done. When i viewed it a 2nd time it really wasnt that bad. I love the part where he ambused lauries parents with the dad getting that punch to the face Its not the greatest thing by far i wasnt expecting much i mean it is rob zombie after all

[BooBerry]

Still I won't deny Rob needs a lot of work in terms of dialogue.

It would help if he took a walk around public areas. Not everyone talks the way he portray's them in his movies.


Try like NO ONE talks like the way he portrays them in his movies. I've been around white trash for quite a few years and I've never heard people talk like he makes his characters. Other than that I agree, the movie was alright.


-Michael magically grows 4 feet and gains 200 pounds of muscle and doesn't speak.


Don't people usually grow with age? I thought that was normal... and he didn't speak in the original either unless I've missed something.

[Elduardo]

When evaluating a horror movie, the quality of the dialogue isn't exactly at the top of my list.

[Chief Falling Rock]

I dug this movie, it had its flaws. Mainly Loomis for me, I didn't like this version of him. But I dug this movie none the less. This movie was gonna get remade regardless of wether Rob Zombie did it or not, and I'm glad he got to do it. Rob had the balls to do something different. We've already seen the original, no need for a shot for shot remake with the same storyline. He went in a completely different direction with it, and I liked it. Michael Myers was tougher than any human probably is yes, but in this flick he wasn't immortal. There was a reason he was the way he was, you almost felt bad for him. All serial killers are fucked up for a reason, and Michael was no exception here. It made him feel more real to me. And I like the fact there was a reason why he wore a mask. I can see how some people wouldn't like that much back story, but I myself liked it. Like I said before, it was something different.

Now don't get me wrong. The original Halloween is one my favorite horror flicks of all time, just so happens I'm wearing a hoodie with Michael Myers face on it right now. But the original didn't hav any kind of back story. Which keeps it mysterious and fun yes, but at the same time just bugs the hell out of me. Now be warned I'm going to spoil the original Halloween, but if you haven't seen it by now do us all a favor and go hang yourself. In the original, this kid goes nuts for no reason and kills his sister. Spends like 15 years in a mental institution, then one day just breaks out and DRIVES A CAR which I'm pretty sure someone in his situation in real life wouldn't know how to do. He automatically knows which chick is his little sister even though its 15 years later (which for some reason is something Rob Zombie kept in his version). Then out of nowhere he's immortal. For some reason you can't kill the guy. All these unanswered things always bugged me, but when you were a kid and heard stories of the boogeyman you never got an explination of him, he just was. Which made him really creepy, and I'm pretty sure thats what Carpenter was going for. And in that aspect I love the original movie, its filmed very well to. One of the few slasher flicks thats actually scary (atleast when I was a kid it scared the crap out of me).

So for me I love both films. Robs version isn't trying to be carpenters version so I view them as 2 seperate films. (although I'm glad he kept the theme music, you can't hope to ever top that).

[Elduardo]

Also some good old fashioned gore in this.

[koolmike]

I don't think RZ has any talent what so ever as far as film making goes..."borrows" too much from movies already made.

[Elduardo]

I'm not sure how much true originality there is in any genre of film.

[koolmike]

True, but IMO, RZ has less than everyone else.

[steelba]

I don't think RZ has any talent what so ever as far as film making goes..."borrows" too much from movies already made.
you're correct..
He'll never make a genre classic, or even anything above average.
He will however have a fanbase like every director, even Uwe Boll has fans (Cata, Meta).

[ShesAKiller]

I actually enjoy rob zombies films which are always full of gore and really messed up/torturous situations. However i have to agree that I had problems with the new Halloween. Being that i loved the original i was really psyched that a remake was being made by rob, but when i saw it the over analyzation of Michael as a young boy really bothered me. I liked Michael more as a character when his violence is unexplained and the story was pretty entertaining so for the most part you really didn't care why he snapped. I see the route the new movie was trying to go in an attempt to perhaps get the audience to sympathize more with Michael's character but the truth is i don't wanna feel sorry for him i just wanna cheer him on while hes killing people. It doesn't hold a candle to carpenter's original film but i did find it mildly entertaining.

[cmurdur]

Tyler Mane brought something more to Myers, rather than trying to be like the Castle copycats. He was huge and menacing and I felt there was something more to his performance than the other portrayals.

[steelba]

aka i'll enjoy whatever they throw at me.

[Elduardo]

Tyler Mane brought something more to Myers, rather than trying to be like the Castle copycats. He was huge and menacing and I felt there was something more to his performance than the other portrayals.

Agreed.

[Elduardo]

Not really concerned about whether or not the movie should have been made, just commenting on the change in the nature of the character.

It's possible to dislike a movie or a part of a movie and be okay with it being released and others enjoying it, although you wouldn't know it by reading some of the comments on this site.

[UzumakiW]

Never bothered watching this.

[Dboyle]

The film was solid, and a brand new take on an old, beaten franchise. While the first two Halloweens were great, the series was butchered after three (which was a blunder in itself). Rob Zombie succeeded in bringing new life to an old series, and I give him respect for that. He totally disregarded the original, which I don't totally agree with...making it not much of a remake, but more of a whole new movie, besides the mask and character names. What made Halloween scary was that he just snapped...a seemingly normal boy, kills his family without explanation, it could happen anywhere. Rob Zombie limited the audience that it appealed to by giving a reason for Michael's outburst.

It doesn't stack up to Carpenter's at all...but I don't totally hate zombie's version.

[steelba]

Never bothered watching this.
you didn't miss anything :straightface: