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  1. #21
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    I will also have to agree with "Wayward" on the issues of remakes we can't stop them from ever happening. Levil and strtfghtr also had a point about the original film not really being enough for what it is (by that i mean more to the story). Each film that gets remade means it has more potential than just being what it was originally. Like what levil said for example: "more gore". i also agree that most remakes don't live up to their predessor, and that they'll never out do the first film but some ppl like them. It's also good for these movies get a reboot so new generations can become fans (not to disrespect the original films of course).:nod:

    For example the new Batman movies: I think the reboot did that francise justice!!! We got so see a newer, darker, grittier, realistic take on the dark knight. Another movie that's also getting a reboot is one most of you might not agree with... "The Crow" (which originally starred the late Brandon Lee). I know alot of ppl have objected this to happen, mostly because the guy who did the "League of Extordinary Gentlemen" is doing it, but heres the thing; This writer/director also did "Blade" (which was an awesome movie by the way), there is no doubt in my mind that he can pull this off and give us a fresher take on the dark hero. I know there are ppl asking "Why?" but if you think about what happen with "Batman" than you'll understand the answer. This movie has so much more potential, although it will never replace Brandon's work in the original. With that said, i'm anxious to see what this director is going to do with "The Crow".:thumbup3:

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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenMoon19 View Post
    I will also have to agree with "Wayward" on the issues of remakes we can't stop them from ever happening. Levil and strtfghtr also had a point about the original film not really being enough for what it is (by that i mean more to the story).
    I never said that.

    For example the new Batman movies: I think the reboot did that francise justice!!! We got so see a newer, darker, grittier, realistic take on the dark knight. Another movie that's also getting a reboot is one most of you might not agree with... "The Crow" (which originally starred the late Brandon Lee). I know alot of ppl have objected this to happen, mostly because the guy who did the "League of Extordinary Gentlemen" is doing it, but heres the thing; This writer/director also did "Blade" (which was an awesome movie by the way), there is no doubt in my mind that he can pull this off and give us a fresher take on the dark hero. I know there are ppl asking "Why?" but if you think about what happen with "Batman" than you'll understand the answer. This movie has so much more potential, although it will never replace Brandon's work in the original. With that said, i'm anxious to see what this director is going to do with "The Crow".:thumbup3:
    Tha's a completely bassackwards example...Batman begins turned Batman around from a campy schlockfest into a dark gritty realistic epic.

    The Original crow was a dark gritty realistic epic...the remake sounds like it will be a campy schlockfest (like the League of Extrordinary Gentlemen) I am NOT looking forward to a Crow remake. If they manage to hit 1/2 the tone the original had I'd be surprised.

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  3. #23
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  4. #24
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    Abashed the Devil stood and felt how awful remakes are.

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  5. #25
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    again i don't know what your problem with me is tbagz, anyway i heard the director is doing like a realistic, documentry style of the Crow, he wants to do it justice but revamp the style of the film. Give a fresh new take on the story. I really think he can pull it off, look what he did with "Blade"!!! The original Crow will always be an epic, i don't think this guy will top that but at least see what he comes up with before being quick to dismiss it!!:nod:

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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenMoon19 View Post
    Levil and strtfghtr also had a point about the original film not really being enough for what it is (by that i mean more to the story)... Like what levil said for example: "more gore".
    I never said this. The originals all hold up well enough on their own, but each decade, a remake is made of a classic from one or two (sometimes more) decades. When I said more gore, I was talking about PD (Platinum Dunes.) They really town down the gore factor in their movies, which sucks. Hammer Studios (if you are unfamiliar with them, look 'em up) took films like Bella Lugosi's Dracula, and amped it up with more mystique, blood and cleavage. They actually out did some of the original Universal monster stories of the 30's and 40's. However, PD destroyed TCM in its first attempt at a remake. They did a decent job with the Hitcher, I didn't bother with Amittyvile since I wasn't really a fan of the original.

    However, although I thoroughly enjoyed the reimaging of F13 (sorry Sutter, I have to disagree with you, I don't think it was a remake at all, for several reasons, yes it combined elements of the first three, but it was its own original story. Saying that would be like saying TDK was a remake of Burton's first Batman. Secondly, it amped up Jason's character from a murderous mongoloid like in the originals, to a sizable force to be reckoned with, but still human like. I could go on, but back to this...) it totally lacked in the gore factor of the original franchise. Yes, it had lots of blood, and a little bit of gore, but where were the scenes like in the beginning of the third one in the grocer? Also, the telling of Jasons moms demise was tame in comparrison to the original.

    When it comes down to it, these icons are adored by several generations, and that is where the problems begin. If one of them is not captured in the light we would like to see them captured, then it is a HUGE let down. This brings it back to naming a remake that is better than the original. I can think of one in the terms of horror icons... but for the sake of this thread, I will refrain. All we as fans can hope for is that if a studio like PD picks up a movie to be remade, that they don't rake it through the muck for the sake of a dollar (much like they did with TCM.)

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  7. #27
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    Blade wasn't that good, it was a fun action movie but the Blade character wasn't nearly dark enough compared to his comic counterpart. The movie veared away from horror and focused mostly on action.

    I'm not saying the new crow is gonna suck but I doubt it will match the original or even come close.

    Back to the topic, I'm never realy surprised when a movie gets remade though you have to question some choices...like why remake Prom Night? the first one sucked

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  8. #28
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    Nice thread Wayward. I wish more people would create thought provoking threads in this forum.

    My feelings on remakes are that they are proof of the writer's and director's lack of originality. Taking an already existing character like Jason or Freddy who have been stagnant as of late, and creating a whole new story or taking us on a new adventure I have no problems with.

    Simply retelling a story already told I couldn't be against more.

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    Last edited by koolmike; 02-24-2009 at 12:49 PM.
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  9. #29
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    I think its a bit of both with remakes.

    On one hand some people involved in the production want to create their own version of the existing story or character. On the other hand the big suits want the return revenue and need the name brand to cash in on the revenue.

    Jason Voorhees
    Micheal Myers
    Freddy Krueger
    Frankenstein
    Dracula
    Werewolves
    Zombies in general

    etc

    All brand names that can return a profit in some shape or form unless the people involved with the project are absolute hacks who can't do anything with it. Whether its Micheal Bay, Marcus Nispel, Rob Zombie, etc. Hack or not, the profit is there as long as you market it towards the era of film making its in.

    I agree with the way filmmakers shoot horror movies today with the shaky camera, etc that its annoying but at the same time I can see why their doing it. They believe it works and perhaps they believe today's audiences are so dumbed down in some respects that they need to make things static in order to keep their attention. Rather than just going with usual camera movements. Nevertheless I don't care what way they decide to film it.

    Whether or not its ok to remake them or not? Varies on what I see on film. Everybody has a different stance on them.

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  10. #30
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  11. #31
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    While I agree that remakes will always happen, Wayward does seem to overlook something in his comparison of the the recent slate of remakes when compared to those of the Hammer days.

    In a lot of cases the Hammer films aren't remakes of the Universal movies, so much as they were Hammer's own adaptations of the same source material the Universal movies were also based on. Not always the case, obviously, but there is outside source material used for a majority of them. Friday the 13th (the original itself often labeled a remake of Bay of Blood) and the rest are not basing themselves on books/novels that are decades/hundreds of years old, just the films.

    Adapting books /= remaking films based on the same source material, unless of course its specifically stated (Psycho for instance)

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    Last edited by Godfatha; 02-24-2009 at 07:51 PM.
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  12. #32
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    Very true. Excellent point.

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    Last edited by koolmike; 02-24-2009 at 08:08 PM.
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  13. #33
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    I put remakes of movies in the same category as covers of songs.... and I judge them on their merits in much of the same way.

    When I hear a cover of a song or watch the remake of a movie movie for the first time, the first thing I decide is, "Did it suck?"

    Not "was it true the original?"
    Not "what was the motive for making this?"
    Not anything other than "Did it suck?"

    I'm extremely openminded to the concept of the Re-Do... There have been a lot of times when I'll watch a movie or hear a song and think "That was a cool concept but the handling left something to be desired.... I wish someone would redo it and realize the concept's potential."

    I certainly don't think that remakes or covers definatively show a lack of creativity in those who make them. In some cases, it takes a lot of creativity to take something that has already been done and while keeping the spirit of the original, add something that makes the viewer or listener say "Wow! That KICKED ASS!!!". A good case in point, albeit a slightly overused case in point, would be Cronenberg's remake of The Fly... it took the original concept in a new direction and, in my opinion, fulfilled the concept's potential.

    Granted, there are examples in both movies and music where the re-do is just a carbon copy of the original, just with different actors... these re-do's aren't worth my time, and they are an example of a lack of creativity. A good example of a re-do that brought nothing new or interesting to the table would be Quarantine.... pretty much a shot-for-shot copy of the original... and complete waste of my time.

    All in all, I don't think remakes/covers should be graded on simply the fact that they are remakes/covers... but on the merits of the film/song itself... what did it bring to the table? how well did it bring it to the table? ... or simply "Did it Suck?"...

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    Last edited by WarBeast; 02-25-2009 at 01:23 AM.


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  14. #34
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  15. #35
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    remaking the crow is blasphemy(sp?), remakes=quick buck. Reputation..at risk for each horror icon. Think about it..what if you made a movie that was brilliant and someone wanted to remake your masterpiece for his or her own benefit. Just because of how well it did.

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  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutter Kane View Post
    I think new Friday is a remake because they took the first 3 movies and combined them into one. TCM also a remake it wasn't a prequel or sequel.

    A reboot is a prequel or sequel to an established franchise. I can live with that. Just leave the originals alone.
    Friday the 13th is a remake? Because they took 1 little detail from each of the first three movies? I don't think so Jim. I don't remember pot fields or underground tunnels in the movies. The camp isn't even fucking open. Where's the counselor camp at? Sure the kids are at a summer home this time but where's the barn or the biker gang, or Shelley?

    Thank God Jason turned into a zombie because his ass would've been 62.

    They're restarting (reboot) the franchise for the mainstream crowd. If it was a remake, the credits would've started rolling right after Pam got her head whacked off. I don't remember, Did they even mentioned the name Alice?

    Halloween 3 was supposed the start the franchise in a new direction. Is it a sequel? No, because Tom Atkins is at the bar and a commercial for the first movie pops up on the tube. How is that furthering the storyline? Is it a prequel? Hell no. A remake? Huh-uh. That movie was an attempted (failed) REBOOT. The fact that you can call a reboot a sequel or a prequel is retarded. There aren't many reboots out there but they do exist.

    Rob Zombie's Halloween is not a reboot (like he calls it), it is a remake.

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  17. #37
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    Good points Toxic... but there was a barn. Other than that, you are dead on, no bikers, no Alice...

    As for Halloween...

    Yes, it was a remake, but Zombie also paid a lot of tribute to the original in his shots/soundtrack...

    Halloween III, really under rated, and I am glad you brought that up. :bigthumbup:

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  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutter Kane View Post
    It ALWAYS falls on the side of a quick buck. Name one remake that was better than the first. (And don't say The Thing, we know the remake is better).

    Because Bram Stoker's Dracula was so scary good....

    It comes down to money with remakes. When it is an original idea at least the creator of the story/script may have some say in the production. A remake is nothing more than people with cash looking to make cash and they don't want to take a risk on something unproven.

    Are remakes inevitable? Yes, but I don't have to like or support them. And that's just American films. The remakes of Asian Horror are IMO downright racist. They take a great movie like Pulse which is a masterpiece and they throw a bunch of American actors and redo the goddamn thing in english?

    Downright despicable.

    If you read very carefully, I never mentioned how many remakes fall on which side of the buck/reimage line. There are films folks consider quality enough to be considered a reimage (or reboot). No arguments on the huge amount of quick buck cash ins outnumbering quality films 100 to 1 at least.

    As for asian horror made by Americans.. Yes, it sucks. Hollywood "americanizes" far too much horror from Europe and further east (heck even a few Auzzie films). In just about every film that gets "americanize", we lose tons in the translation. The best we can do is hunt down the original and be proud of the fact that we can enjoy films with subtitles, unlike Hollywood's target audiance (apparently).

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  19. #39
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    [QUOTE=Nija;797520]remaking the crow is blasphemy(sp?), remakes=quick buck. Reputation..at risk for each horror icon.[QUOTE]

    Is it a remake or is someone else just trying their hand at making a movie out of the Crow comic book? Perhaps the new Crow movie will out-shine the original... Unless you have a magic TV that allows you to watch movies that haven't been made, you have no way of knowing one way or the other yet.

    Think about it..what if you made a movie that was brilliant and someone wanted to remake your masterpiece for his or her own benefit. Just because of how well it did.
    Again, you are presuming that all remakes suck, and that the only reason the makers of them have for doing the remakes is for easy money. In some cases that may be true... In other cases, it may be because the people involved ARE fans of the original and are doing it as a tribute... OR maybe they saw the original and thought it was a neat concept, but thought they could do better.

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  20. #40
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    [QUOTE=WarBeast;797566][QUOTE=Nija;797520]remaking the crow is blasphemy(sp?), remakes=quick buck. Reputation..at risk for each horror icon.

    Is it a remake or is someone else just trying their hand at making a movie out of the Crow comic book? Perhaps the new Crow movie will out-shine the original... Unless you have a magic TV that allows you to watch movies that haven't been made, you have no way of knowing one way or the other yet.



    Again, you are presuming that all remakes suck, and that the only reason the makers of them have for doing the remakes is for easy money. In some cases that may be true... In other cases, it may be because the people involved ARE fans of the original and are doing it as a tribute... OR maybe they saw the original and thought it was a neat concept, but thought they could do better.
    Ok, yeah. But still its like setting up a lemonade stand, and having some jerk build his right next to yours. Steal your customers because they are fans of lemonade of course. Just because that person can bring more pizzaz to the table. Its no better than a generic brand. Same content but cheaper(not a great comparison but think about it).

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